Question:

Allergy Epidemic U.S. News & World Report May 8, 2000 Page 47-48 ….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were=  bored…. …..It’s hard to document the incidence of allergy, partly because epidemiologists have tended to focus on asthma. But in some countries, including England, New Zealand, and Australia, statistics confirm a rise in allergies. In the United States, the numbers aren’t firm., but reports of one symptom, rhinitis, rose 31 percent from 1985 to 1995. The increases are too rapid to be caused by genetic changes. And people living in Eastern Russia, India, Indonesia, and rural Africa report far less trouble with allergies, even though there’s no lack of pollen, dust mites, and other triggers.=20 "Something about the Western style of living has given rise to more allergies," (Note: Key remark) says Donald Leung, head of the pediatric allergy division at National Jewish Medical and Research Center in Denver. …So molecular biologists are looking for ways to confer the benefits of dirty living without the risks. Researchers are already experimenting with "vaccines" made of Mycobacterium vaccae, a soil pathogen that doesn’t sicken humans, to see if it will encourage a Th1 response. Others are investigating whether bits of DNA, called CpG motifs, which are unique to bacteria, can be used the same way=96an approach that has already been used to reduce=  allergic asthma in laboratory mice…. http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/000508/allergies.htm I found this interesting ’cause it supports the theory that one of the reasons for my continuing good health may be the constant exposure to a variety of bacteria which comes with bare-handed farming & gardening – my immune system simply doesn’t have time to attack my myelin.  But I don’t think a vaccine will work.  imo Injecting bacteria into the bloodstream is too direct & too strong an attack immune systems – natural exposure occurs when minute amounts of such bacteria enter via cuts, inhalation or=  ingestion. Chris F Chris F Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.=20  -Thomas Edison

Response:

Too much hygiene will never be a problem in our house.   I agree though, that exposure to natural soil pathogens is generally beneficial to the immune system.   On this theory, I raised my kids dirty and naked (well, some of the time anyway), and exposed them to common childhood diseases early.  They are all healthy adults now, and often even wear clothes.   Carmel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Chris Fincham wrote:

Allergy Epidemic U.S. News & World Report May 8, 2000 Page 47-48 ….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were=  bored…. …..It’s hard to document the incidence of allergy, partly because epidemiologists have tended to focus on asthma. But in some countries, including England, New Zealand, and Australia, statistics confirm a rise in allergies. In the United States, the numbers aren’t firm., but reports of one symptom, rhinitis, rose 31 percent from 1985 to 1995. The increases are too rapid to be caused by genetic changes. And people living in Eastern Russia, India, Indonesia, and rural Africa report far less trouble with allergies, even though there’s no lack of pollen, dust mites, and other triggers.=20 "Something about the Western style of living has given rise to more allergies," (Note: Key remark) says Donald Leung, head of the pediatric allergy division at National Jewish Medical and Research Center in Denver. …So molecular biologists are looking for ways to confer the benefits of dirty living without the risks. Researchers are already experimenting with "vaccines" made of Mycobacterium vaccae, a soil pathogen that doesn’t sicken humans, to see if it will encourage a Th1 response. Others are investigating whether bits of DNA, called CpG motifs, which are unique to bacteria, can be used the same way=96an approach that has already been used to reduce=  allergic asthma in laboratory mice…. http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/000508/allergies.htm I found this interesting ’cause it supports the theory that one of the reasons for my continuing good health may be the constant exposure to a variety of bacteria which comes with bare-handed farming & gardening – my immune system simply doesn’t have time to attack my myelin.  But I don’t think a vaccine will work.  imo Injecting bacteria into the bloodstream is too direct & too strong an attack immune systems – natural exposure occurs when minute amounts of such bacteria enter via cuts, inhalation or=  ingestion. Chris F Chris F Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.=20  -Thomas Edison

— " Don’t wait for a light to appear at the end of the tunnel.   Stride down there and light the bloody thing yourself." www.cyberwizards.com.au/~carmel www.cyberwizards.com.au/~jaragun

Response:

You’ve probably got something there, Sylvia.  Less people would certainly improve things.  Maybe nature is taking care of this, anyway. All the pollution and chemical interference with our food seems to be making the race infertile.  This generation (in general) seems to have more trouble reproducing than in the past, and that seems to be largely die to male infertility.   Agricultural chemicals, pesticides and household cleaners all mimic estrogen, and are ingested in water, food and the air we breathe.  Add to that battery animals fed food laced with growth hormones and antibiotics, then fed to people, and you don’t have to look much farther for a cause of male (or female, for that matter) infertility and immune system problems. Now we have – apparently – global warming due to mankind’s polluting activities, which is predicted to cause famines in the next generation. So latest forecasts predict that the world’s population will start to fall within fifty years.  If it isn’t already too late, maybe that will solve the problem.   We’ve really shat in our nest, haven’t we?  And people are so complacent about it, because they can’t see anything much happening right now, and none of it seems to be affecting them directly.  It’s very short-sighted, in my opinion.  We should be leaving the world in a better condition than when we entered it, as a legacy to our children and grandchildren.  That notion seems incredibly outdated now, and people aren’t looking past their own noses. I remember when I was a teenager searching for the answers to "life, the universe and everything",  I worked out that the human race is like an infection on the planet, put here to destroy the green stuff that grows like mould on the earth – (forests and plants, that is).  When the job is done, we will die out and the mission will have been accomplished. Earth will once again be cleansed of the infestation of life. Typical teenage pessimism, I suppose, but I still think it may not be too far from the truth, in many ways. As to the product of composting toilets, it’s just like soil (earth). It doesn’t smell bad and can be safely handled.  All the pathogens have been killed by the composting process, and the liquid evaporated out of it, so it’s just a really small amount of sweet-smelling earth.  You can use it to grow plants in the garden or in pots. It takes at least six months to get enough of the end product to fertilise a garden bed. FAR less trouble than a large weekly sack of plastics and smelly food scraps. If you want to see more info on composting toilets here are some links: http://www.clivusmultrum.com/ www.biolet.com/ http://www.greenbuilder.com/Sourcebook/CompostToilet.html   Carmel – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -SYLV77 wrote:

Hi Carmel! I agree with you on the wasting of water problem.  In this country, it is now illegal to sell toilets that use the old standard of 5 gallons a flush.  Has it helped? I don’t know if anyone has done a study on this. <<  (Composting toilets) use no water, don’t smell if managed properly, and produce a usable product (compost for the garden).  Most importantly, they don’t pollute anything, unless badly mismanaged. But I don’t think this would work.  There is not enough garden space to take the compost in the city.  And I don’t think people would be eager to use such a product!  People around here have trouble managing their normal garbage; I’d hate to think of what they’d do with this stuff! My solution to the water pollution (and air pollution and land pollution) problems?  Less people. Sylvia (off my soapbox now!)

— " Don’t wait for a light to appear at the end of the tunnel.   Stride down there and light the bloody thing yourself." www.cyberwizards.com.au/~carmel www.cyberwizards.com.au/~jaragun

Response:

        Hi Gang,           I just heard on the radio today that ?????? had inadvertantly connected a sewer pipe to a water line….. YUCK      Joyce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -CPD wrote:

In a world where precious water is being polluted/wasted at a tragic rate, I really can’t agree.  Sure, flush toilets are convenient, and in a high-rise building, for instance, I don’t know what kind of alternative would be possible.  But it really seems incredibly stupid to take good pure water, pollute it with waste, and then flush it away to pollute other water in streams, oceans and ground water, from where we will be taking drinking water. In a normal single-story house, even in a big city, composting toilets are a very viable alternative, in my opinion.  They use no water, don’t smell if managed properly, and produce a usable product (compost for the garden).  Most importantly, they don’t pollute anything, unless badly mismanaged. They don’t have to be outdoors.  Modern ones are in the house and look very much like normal flushing models.  Some use heated air (by solar or mains power), and some use earthworms.  The price used to be prohibitive, and most local councils would not approve their use.  Both of these problems are now largely resolved.  Price is now about the same as a septic system for many models. Most of us use modern "conveniences", like flushing toilets, without any thought for the long-term consequences of millions of people doing the same.  The problem is huge, and will only get bigger unless we address it.  It’s just not true that "one person can do nothing about it."  The solution starts with us, right now. Climbing down off my soapbox now. Carmel dciREM…@cheetah.net wrote: On 16 May 2000 21:38:31 GMT, kamatth…@aol.com (Kathi Matthews) wrote: In article <200005161150.e4GBo0X15…@mail.peterboro.net, finc…@PETERBORO.NET (Chris Fincham) writes: ….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were= bored…. I’m still partial to flush toilets, though.  :=} Kathi One of the modern conveniences, for sure! Donn — " Don’t wait for a light to appear at the end of the tunnel.   Stride down there and light the bloody thing yourself." www.cyberwizards.com.au/~carmel www.cyberwizards.com.au/~jaragun

Response:

Hi Carmel! I agree with you on the wasting of water problem.  In this country, it is now illegal to sell toilets that use the old standard of 5 gallons a flush.  Has it helped? I don’t know if anyone has done a study on this. <<  (Composting toilets) use no water, don’t smell if managed properly, and produce a usable product (compost for the garden).  Most importantly, they don’t pollute anything, unless badly mismanaged.    

But I don’t think this would work.  There is not enough garden space to take the compost in the city.  And I don’t think people would be eager to use such a product!  People around here have trouble managing their normal garbage; I’d hate to think of what they’d do with this stuff! My solution to the water pollution (and air pollution and land pollution) problems?  Less people. Sylvia (off my soapbox now!)

Response:

Bio Bac Interest (Additional Info) ; ;  Tryin to spread the words. ; ;  Good thinkin, Group… The diagnosis of Asthma as a health affliction has increased by 500% since 1970. Thats a lot of numbers for not so many years. The best I get to this mail thing is every third day or so… ; ;  Yes I got it and I understand that we are waiting for confirmation (?) Thats o.k. cause I am moving at the current time. ; ;  Moving to an environment with much cleaner air. ; ;  I hope to be relocated by mid-June but I am also curious and anxious about the effectiveness of increasing the production of Regulatory Hormones. ; ;  Otherwise I feel fairly normal (remember too that my pain threshold is much higher than most) Fell down in a parking lot very hard yesterday. Had kind of a waking vision the other day. A notion came suddenly to mind that it isn’t the fact that there are too many white blood cells, It’s the fact that there aren’t enough CERTAIN (or Specific) ones. The Chalmydia infection and age spots remain. The birthmark is where the person first touched you. But back to the infection, This means that the foriegn organism is still latched on from within, it hasn’t been overcome by the immune system? Wonder why?, I believe it’s because the REGULATION of the endocrine system is operating incorrectly due to the underproduction of REGULATORY hormone cells in most cases. (such as T4 and subsequently T3). If this is true of most autoimmune diseases, then the intentional increase of an organism specifically targeted to increase Regulatory Hormone cell production should improve the condition of the organism. An Interesting side note is that I bet women overall as a group have an incidence of being twice as likely to aquire an autoimmune disease than men do. The ratio of MS is that it affects twice as many women than is does men. ; ;  Back to Why? (They have nearly twice as many hormones at any given time?) l8r…….Included in the pages: In article

Some researchers have taken the good dirt idea a little farther.  I

read an article in Science News sometime within the past year where people with intestinal problems were put in a double blind trial where the active treatment was a glass of water with live hook worms in it. The hypothesis was that we had evolved playing host to hook worms and that eliminating them from our digestive systems was causing a problem.

The treatment proved effective. Prosit (Here’s to your health), —–Original Message—– Date: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 12:19 PM Subject: Re: OT: Allergy Epidemic (autoimmune-related) "Something about the Western style of living has given rise to

moreallergies,"

IMHO, this "something" is all the chemicals we are living with. Maybe "dirty" living is beneficial because you wouldn’t be using

hazardous chemicals to clean everything.  The people in the areas cited in this article are probably poor and can’t afford the"modern" cleaning products and personal care products with all the chemicals. l8r http://community.webtv.net/Hotmoth/MSReflections http://community.webtv.net/Hotmoth/andsoturnstheworld http://community.webtv.net/Hotmoth/PerpetualResume

Response:

In article <39224E1E.AA8CC…@cyberwizards.com.au

, CPD

<car…@cyberwizards.com.au

writes: In a normal single-story house, even in a big city, composting toilets are a very viable alternative, in my opinion.  

I doubt many people would do this.  In any case, I live in an apartment. Kathi

Response:

In article <200005161150.e4GBo0X15…@mail.peterboro.net

,

finc…@PETERBORO.NET (Chris Fincham) writes:

….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were= bored….

I’m still partial to flush toilets, though.  :=} Kathi

Response:

On 16 May 2000 21:38:31 GMT, kamatth…@aol.com (Kathi Matthews) wrote:

In article <200005161150.e4GBo0X15…@mail.peterboro.net, finc…@PETERBORO.NET (Chris Fincham) writes: ….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were= bored…. I’m still partial to flush toilets, though.  :=} Kathi

One of the modern conveniences, for sure! Donn

Response:

In a world where precious water is being polluted/wasted at a tragic rate, I really can’t agree.  Sure, flush toilets are convenient, and in a high-rise building, for instance, I don’t know what kind of alternative would be possible.  But it really seems incredibly stupid to take good pure water, pollute it with waste, and then flush it away to pollute other water in streams, oceans and ground water, from where we will be taking drinking water.   In a normal single-story house, even in a big city, composting toilets are a very viable alternative, in my opinion.  They use no water, don’t smell if managed properly, and produce a usable product (compost for the garden).  Most importantly, they don’t pollute anything, unless badly mismanaged.   They don’t have to be outdoors.  Modern ones are in the house and look very much like normal flushing models.  Some use heated air (by solar or mains power), and some use earthworms.  The price used to be prohibitive, and most local councils would not approve their use.  Both of these problems are now largely resolved.  Price is now about the same as a septic system for many models. Most of us use modern "conveniences", like flushing toilets, without any thought for the long-term consequences of millions of people doing the same.  The problem is huge, and will only get bigger unless we address it.  It’s just not true that "one person can do nothing about it."  The solution starts with us, right now. Climbing down off my soapbox now.   Carmel   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -dciREM…@cheetah.net wrote:

On 16 May 2000 21:38:31 GMT, kamatth…@aol.com (Kathi Matthews) wrote: In article <200005161150.e4GBo0X15…@mail.peterboro.net, finc…@PETERBORO.NET (Chris Fincham) writes: ….As modern life has become more hygienic, what with indoor plumbing, immunizations, and antibiotics, the human immune system has run out of things to do. It attacks allergens, and the body itself, as if it were= bored…. I’m still partial to flush toilets, though.  :=} Kathi One of the modern conveniences, for sure! Donn

— " Don’t wait for a light to appear at the end of the tunnel.   Stride down there and light the bloody thing yourself." www.cyberwizards.com.au/~carmel www.cyberwizards.com.au/~jaragun

Response:

<< "Something about the Western style of living has given rise to more allergies,"  

IMHO, this "something" is all the chemicals we are living with. Maybe "dirty" living is beneficial because you wouldn’t be using hazardous chemicals to clean everything.  The people in the areas cited in this article are probably poor and can’t afford the "modern" cleaning products and personal care products with all the chemicals. Just a thought. . . Sylvia

Response:

In article <39212F55.4D58C…@cyberwizards.com.au

, CPD

<car…@cyberwizards.com.au

wrote:

| They are all healthy adults now, and often even wear clothes.   Hi Carmel, I know it is difficult when a child grows up in ways you didn’t intend ! — Take care James (#11)

Response:

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