My Crohn's and Colitis Blog » Bronchial Asthma Treatment » Dr. Grossan's new nasal irrigation device

Dr. Grossan's new nasal irrigation device

Question:

"Harry Avant" <hav…@earthlink.net

wrote in message

news:3d9b3281.1600940@news.earthlink.net…

No Doc I didn’t.  I don’t have insurance or  anything similar – I have Kaiser—–)!  BTW my cost for Flonase is $5.  That’s a LOT less expensive than the Hydro Pulse.

Harry-just semantics, but yes you do have medical insurance–Kaiser is a type of medical insurance called HMO!

Response:

"ENTconsult" <entcons…@aol.com

wrote in message

news:20021002011741.10744.00011341@mb-cu.aol.com…

Since the cost of the HydroPulse is less than many antibiotic

prescriptions and

about the same as one Flonase,

Kind of a silly comparison, no, apples and oranges? No, apples and oranges are both fruits at least, much closer than comparing an irrigation device to a prescription medicine. Does one bottle of Flonase now really cost about $90-$100? (Besides, most people have prescription insurance that pays most of the cost, and prices in other countries is much lower than the U.S.) (If anyone gets reimbursed anything for your irrigation device, I’m sure it would be much less than what they paid for it, a small fraction–like $10 reimbursement.)

insurance companies are FINALLY coming to realize that they save money by paying for this device that lasts for

years and

reduces need for many medications. Murray Grossan, M.D.

How do you know that they are FINALLY coming to realize that? Do you have any data on how many people have been reimbursed yet, out of how many claims submitted, and how much the reimbursement was? (You keep asking for such info here.) If you don’t have such data yet, how do you know that they are FINALLY coming to realize that? (Because you think that saying so will help sales?) If you have data, please report it here. Specific data please, not generalities like the above. If no data, how do you know what they are FINALLY coming to realize? (The word FINALLY is a little strange in this context too, as your device just came out. Sounds like claims have been submitted and denied for years, but they are only now FINALLY coming to realize the "truth".) As far as reducing the need for medications, there sure are a lot of people who have been writing regularly to this newsgroup for years, who have been irrigating for years, and still have used a lot of medications, no?

Response:

There is another such device, cheaper than both WP and HP (Grossan), with the same advantages you mention below of the latter. The Interplak oral irrigator. (www.interplak.com). I think on the web site it says $35 or so, but in stores I’ve seen it for about $30. (At least in California, it’s in all the major drug stores–Rite-Aid, Sav-on, etc.) The Grossan nasal irrigator tip fits the Interplak device, and I assume other brands of nasal irrigator tip that fit Waterpik will fit the Interplak device as well. It (the Interplak irrigator) is much quieter than the Waterpik. It has a rotary dial on the base to adjust pressure–as you say more convenient than the handle pressure button on the WP. It (IP) has a two year warranty. (I don’t recall the WP warranty, and don’t know the HP warranty. Perhaps others can fill that info in.) It (the IP) seems to be much more durable than the WP, which (WP) have often broken down. (Although the WP company has been good about replacing them.) I don’t know about the durability of the HP, but the instructions in the manual to wait 5 minutes between every tank usage gives me cause to wonder. (People who have the unit, please report on its durability over time.) The only disadvantage to me of the IP is that the tank is about half the size of the WP, 500 ml vs 1000 ml for the WP. For most people that probably doesn’t matter, as 500 ml is probably enough for most people to irrigate more. I often need more, so need to refill more with the IP. (Grossan’s HP is the same smaller size as the IP, 500ml.) I e-mailed the IP company (Conair), and suggested they make a larger tank model, and I got a reply that sounds like they might be planning that. Their web site shows two other models besides the basic one (both more expensive), but neither with a larger tank (one has a double tank, I don’t quite see the point of that). I don’t see any advantage to either of their more expensive models. (Same with WP–nothing better about "professional", "deluxe", etc. models.) I’d be happy to get one with a larger tank though. From the descriptions I have seen of the Grossan Hydro-Pulse (I haven’t tried one, although I have read the manual and seen the box in a store), I don’t see any advantage of it over the Interplak irrigation device, which costs about one third of the HP’s price. Has anyone reading tried both the Interplak oral irrigator and Grossan Hydro-Pulse, and could compare the two? (I’ve compared the former with the Waterpik, and a couple people have compared the latter with the WP, but it would be interesting to hear from someone who has used IP and HP.) "Harry Avant" <hav…@earthlink.net

wrote in message

news:3d99de20.1397972@news.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I’ve been using the Grossan device for a few weeks.  I used a WP with the Grossan tip for about a year.  The new Grossan is much quieter and it a lot easier to adjust for pressure.  Compared to the WP it’s considerably more expensive probably due to the limited number made, but I think it’s far better for nasal irrigation. Harry Bruce <bla…@chartermi.net wrote: Can anyone give me a web page or an e-mail with information on his newly developed irrigator?  I’d like to know if anyone has used it yet and how it compared with using the WaterPik with the Grossan tip. Thanks…. — Bruce

Response:

I’ve been using the Grossan device for a few weeks.  I used a WP with the Grossan tip for about a year.  The new Grossan is much quieter and it a lot easier to adjust for pressure.  Compared to the WP it’s considerably more expensive probably due to the limited number made, but I think it’s far better for nasal irrigation. Harry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Bruce <bla…@chartermi.net

wrote: Can anyone give me a web page or an e-mail with information on his newly developed irrigator?  I’d like to know if anyone has used it yet and how it compared with using the WaterPik with the Grossan tip. Thanks…. — Bruce

Response:

Harry: did you apply to insurance for reimbursement for the Hydro Pulse? You need to send a copy of your receipt, a note from your doctor with diagnosis and need for the device, and some of the references that recommend its use given two letters back or you can take from www.hydromedonline.com Since the cost of the HydroPulse is less than many antibiotic prescriptions and about the same as one Flonase, insurance companies are FINALLY coming to realize that they save money by paying for this device that lasts for years and reduces need for many medications. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net http://www.emedicine.com/ent/topic516.htm

Response:

No Doc I didn’t.  I don’t have insurance or  anything similar – I have Kaiser—–)!  BTW my cost for Flonase is $5.  That’s a LOT less expensive than the Hydro Pulse. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -entcons…@aol.com (ENTconsult) wrote:

Harry: did you apply to insurance for reimbursement for the Hydro Pulse? You need to send a copy of your receipt, a note from your doctor with diagnosis and need for the device, and some of the references that recommend its use given two letters back or you can take from www.hydromedonline.com Since the cost of the HydroPulse is less than many antibiotic prescriptions and about the same as one Flonase, insurance companies are FINALLY coming to realize that they save money by paying for this device that lasts for years and reduces need for many medications. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net http://www.emedicine.com/ent/topic516.htm

Response:

in article 20020930205101.00965.00011…@mb-ch.aol.com, ENTconsult at entcons…@aol.com wrote on 9/30/02 8:51 PM:

Please see www.hydromedonline.com for info on Hydro Pulse. when you send in to your insurance company for reimbursement send copy of your receipt, your diagnosis and reason for this FDA Registered device – The Hydro Pulse. Also copy some of the references for the device – you can use these: Insurance wants clinical data to verify that this is a reasonable method. Enclose References: Allergy And Sinusitis Inhibition Of The Seasonal Ige Increase To Dactylis Glomerata By Daily Saline Nasal – Sinus Irrigation During The Grass Pollen Season, J. Subiza, M.D. Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology. September 1999. Pulsatile irrigation works for allergy by removing the IgE so that the pollen doesn’t cause symptoms.

You are doing it again. The article does NOT say that irrigation removes IgE. It does not measure IgE in the nose. It could hardly do so, as there is none prsent in nasal secretions. At no place in the article does it mention any determination of symptoms, before or after irrigation. You have been misrepresenting this article to us for well over a year. Your way of responding to having it pointed out that the article says none of this is to simply ignore the comment, and to repeat the misrepresentation over and over and over. Come on now, let’s see a quotation or two from the article that states what you say it states.     A reader

Response:

Please see www.hydromedonline.com for info on Hydro Pulse. when you send in to your insurance company for reimbursement send copy of your receipt, your diagnosis and reason for this FDA Registered device – The Hydro Pulse. Also copy some of the references for the device – you can use these: Insurance wants clinical data to verify that this is a reasonable method. Enclose References:   Allergy And Sinusitis Inhibition Of The Seasonal Ige Increase To Dactylis Glomerata By Daily Saline Nasal – Sinus Irrigation During The Grass Pollen Season, J. Subiza, M.D. Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology. September 1999. Pulsatile irrigation works for allergy by removing the IgE so that the pollen doesn’t cause symptoms. Medical Management of Rhinitis, Fadal R. English: Otolaryngology Vol 2:Ch 13  The principal benefits from saline irrigation include: 1. Augments mucociliary flow 2 Liquefies tenacious mucus 3. Soothes irritated tissues 4. Removes crusts and microforeign bodies 5. Augments tissue repair 6. Reduces forceful noseblowing 7. Improves olfaction. Rhinitis, Allergy: Principles and Practice, 3rd edition. Middleton E. CV Mosby Company Ch 17, 1988  All forms of  allergic rhinitis are benefited by pulsatile saline irrigation Asthma Sinusitis and Bronchial Asthma, Slavin RG: J Allergy and Clinical Immunol 66:250-257, 1980 Slavin presents three mechanisms re sinusitis causing asthma. Clearing sinusitis is important in asthma. Post Operative Care Evaluation of methods of Sinus Nasal Irrigation Irrigation Post Sinus Surgery, Cenjor, C. Gutierrez, R. Congress of Spanish Society of Otolaryngology and Cervical Facial Pathology. Las Palmas de Gran canaria, 12- 16 Octubre de 1998

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